Epic GTA2 Map Editor (0.6.6602) Beta

[T.M.]

Sometimes collectibles are placed in tunnels or in mid air. This should still be possible. If the editor can detect if the 3d coordinate is redundant i think its a good idea. There is only one situation i could think of where this is maybe not wanted: someone places a powerup on the ground but midgame the block below will be removed and the powerup shout stay in mid air. I don't know where gta will actually place it or if someone wants to make such a map but it would be no harm if it is possible to manually force a coordinate pair to be 3d.

Yeah you can force it to be 3d by adjusting the z-position up and down sequentially. I dont think we need own key for that...

Also the tunnels works fine, since it tests at save-time if the object can be dropped in the tunnel: if it cant, then it uses 3d coordinates, if it can, then it uses 2d coordinates.

[Pyro]

I always put the full X-Y-Z co-ords in. The only times I don't use a Z co-ord is only on things that don't need one (such as cranes - they are automatically placed at the highest cube set to field) or using a Z of 255.0 if I know I'm putting stuff on slopes/steps (such as a powerup), assuming there is nothing above it (such as a bridge over a slope).

I just hope it won't turn into a Microsoft Word type of "feature" where the program thinks it knows best but actually gets extremely annoying where you spend 20 minutes trying to fix something that should have only taken 10 seconds to do

I am thinking to re-do this to act in the following way: convert to 2d coordinates always when possible. Is this good idea?

If stuff is saved in 3D co-ords, leave it alone. Also not a great idea if even moving it slightly it removes the Z co-ord on its own. Overall, having it in 3D co-ords give more control/precision over the item. If the map radically changes then you'll have to move it anyway.

[T.M.]

If the map radically changes then you'll have to move it anyway.

It is decided on save-time, means if you edited the map and added a block above it, it wont pop above the block when you save

I find it more logical to add z-coord only when you NEED it, for example if you put stuff on the air, you can see from your code that it REALLY is on the air because you forced it to use z-coord. So you can clearly see whether or not the object lays on a surface or not.

I think it is less error prone when you dont include z-coordinate on stuff that are supposed to lay on a ground. For example i found nasty bug in DAFE's death valley where the gang powerup was on air, instead of laying on the ground, thus i couldnt pick it up. IF he used 2d coordinates, this would have never happened

What you think?

[Pyro]

For example i found nasty bug in DAFE's death valley where the gang powerup was on air, instead of laying on the ground, thus i couldnt pick it up. IF he used 2d coordinates, this would have never happened

Also called not testing properly Such simple mistakes can (should) be easily fixed. I say it's handy but as I've said before, I'm probably to stuck in my specific ways of coding. I can't actually imagine not using a Z co-ord in all my years of coding! I very rarely put objects/cars/stuff on slopes anyway and I use a Z of 255.0 for it if needs be.

At least this is a better feature than the map edge repeating stuff we locked horns over

PS - With all this stuff being added it still, when can we, the rest of us, play with it?

[T.M.]

I guess i could add option to turn the 2d/3d coordinate automation off.

TODO:
- conveyors/destructors width/height edit (like zone editor rectangles editing).
- crane powerup trigger edit/save.
- render car object list. (hard to make it look good )
- render obj_data object list.
- object add from the list.
- object delete.
- object copy/paste.
- string color function (to make fancy text in the editor easily).
- show object collision boxes by pressing space or some other button.
- fix car on trailer rotation (although i really dont care if it points at wrong direction... i find it more realistic that way anyways )
- display car shops respray color in the object directly.
- test GTA2 behaviour on some things.

I might be able to give test version to those who want to test it now when its half ready (only object position/angle editing works)

Also, im still thinking how the script saving should go, overwrite the old file? Because i am not very confident the script will be saved properly at this stage of development

Edit: Who wants to test it, just send PM to me. Test version requirements: you really will test it completely, not just click two times and then exit And report from your testing too. All this done in PM, not on this thread.

[Razor]

you can send me that version

[elypter]

you could save a backup before overwriting.

[T.M.]

you could save a backup before overwriting.

And then i will have billion backup files... Well, i guess thats better than nothing. Hmm, i could save only like 10 backup files for each map, and delete the oldest when 10 is full?

[elypter]

you could save a backup before overwriting.

And then i will have billion backup files... Well, i guess thats better than nothing. Hmm, i could save only like 10 backup files for each map, and delete the oldest when 10 is full?

10 backups ought to be enough for anybody
no, really, i think 10 is enough and not too much.

[BenMillard]

Use a File > Save... menu (along with a File Save As... menu) and only save when the user operates one of these. No need for a backups system within every individual editor; in fact that makes backups a total nightmare because they'll all be made in different ways:

• DMA editor uses *.auto files
• 3D GTA tools sometimes added .bak at the end.
• Some changed extension to .bak so you can't tell what it was originally!
• Others copy the file to a backups folder.
• All sorts of date formats are sometimes added to filenames.

People should make backups before they start using a new editor. It's worth making occasional backups of a mod while developing it, so you can revert unpopular changes and review ideas you've already tried. So your tool doesn't (and shouldn't!) add any backup feature.

[T.M.]

Oh well, maybe i just backup it once when you load the map first time & save the script, and when you close the editor and load the map again/save script, it replaces the previous backup. This would add some sort of safety so it wont blow up your hard work when you try it first time... (might have some evil bugs, after all, its only an early beta). The backups will go to the editor folder.

[T.M.]

I'm thinking now, how to make the object creation, and i need your opinions and ideas about this, since its very important for the users of this editor.

Current plan:
1) When you double right click the ground (not an object), you get a screen to select which object to create.
2) When you have selected data type, it will be placed on the mouse cursor position, and the same object icon/datatype will be displayed at the left menu.
3) Next time you press CTRL+N, it will create the object from left menu at your mouse position.

This is my sketch from the menu where you select which type you want to use:

Notice you can select the type of the object data, CREATE_* would be placed after LEVELSTART automatically, declarations before LEVELSTART, ...or in that place in script which you select yourself.

I am thinking if i should move the mouse automatically in the middle of that selection screen. It might feel confusing once the mouse returns to that position where you first time clicked. i dont know, i have never used such an UI before.

Also, i am thinking should i display CREATE_* things at all in there... but it really needs an options for those. Newbies wont probably understand the difference, and might misunderstand it; for a newbie: create_obj = "create the object", obj_data = "declaration only" etc.

[Sektor]

I was thinking you could just have icons on the left like the tiles but with pictures of the objects. You could then drag/copy the objects anywhere you wanted.

[T.M.]

Yeah, that was my first plan as well. But i dropped it because i find it more compact if i dont have to switch the left menu to some other menu before creating an object.

But as i said, i am taking ideas, and i will think of this more, nothing has been decided yet.

[Cuban-Pete]

I haven't made any maps, but I also like the blender 2.5 "way". You press spacebar and type in "light" or "sound" and it shows a list you can pick from. Something like that.

[T.M.]

I thought of that too, but SPACE is currently reserved for showing objects ranges :/ Its perfect for that because you can move and press space at same time. I tried other keys but they werent as good with other key combinations...

I could make it work like the blender list:

Code: Select all

LIGHT -> LIGHT
         CREATE_LIGHT

etc.

But isnt it faster to choose from a square, you only move left right up down etc? easier/faster to select the proper type i think.

[Cuban-Pete]

But isnt it faster to choose from a square, you only move left right up down etc? easier/faster to select the proper type i think.

Yeah I guess that is faster as long as the squares don't get loaded with too many options (and get unclear).

[T.M.]

Yeah, i was thinking if you could come up with some clever icons for those Its quite hard though... :/ Not that much needed though... but if you come up with something, i would like to know

[Pyro]

Interesting...

Some ideas for icons for the code types:

• Silhouette of a guy (almost think of the Counter Strike symbol ) for things relating to characters and players.
• Silhouette of a car for... guess what... car stuff! Includes normal cars and gang cars.
• A 3D wire-frame box or something for objects.
• An icon of just a weapon for stuff relating to guns (for players, characters and vehicles).
• A speaker next to a light-bulb (or light-bulb in lamp-shade) for the "scenery" type stuff for lights and sounds. Maybe a hi-fi icon for sound?
• Silhouette of a brain or something for AI stuff. Would include giving characters orders, threat search, patrol points etc.

Erm, probably could think of a few more things but that's a few to get started with anyway

[Cuban-Pete]

I just stole some images on google and made this idea. Is it in the right direction or?

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