Epic GTA2 Map Editor (0.6.6602) Beta

[T.M.]

I like the idea but it makes the map look very strange. Liked having it with the infinite water on but now having the buildings etc stretched is too weird. Small maps (like mine as you've shown in your screeny) are gonna look weird!

So as you see, after you save the map in my editor, the map would look like the GTA2 is repeating the edges, but its actually my editor trick

I'm hoping it is just a visual thing (like infinite water) rather than actually adding physical blocks to the edges? Also hopefully it is an optional option to pick on/off?

GTA2 does this to every map, i dont see why i should not do it like this on any size map as well... you should never be able to see the map edges IMO. If GTA2 had dynamic map sizes, it would work the same way, would look in game like that.

Adding those blocks at the edges wont even make the map size much larger, or at all.

But yeah, i will make it as an option, though, i dont see why should i make it as an option since you would edit the map without seeing those repetitive edges: those are added when you save the map, and you wont even be aware of the repetitive edges ingame since GTA2 repeats the edges by default anyways.

That screenshot just showed how would it work; every block outside of the MapArea will be ignored in the editor and not be rendered at all.

[Cuban-Pete]

I like "the normal" way more. It's just a nice little map, it doesn't need unlimited water and rails, lol.

If the map maker did his job properly then there is no need for unlimited water etc, because you can't see the edge of the map during playing (even with alt+arrows not).

[T.M.]

You just have to be aware of this setting, as if you made 256x256 map, you have to know the edges will be repeated, in my editor it will always repeat the edges on any size map. So we can have custom size maps without you need to repeat edges on your own to make it look good in GTA2...

It doesnt look good if the map suddenly has nothing outside of the edges and you start seeing those previous frame pixels at places with nothing on there = ugly

[Pyro]

Cuban Pete hit the nail on the head there:

If the map maker did his job properly then there is no need for unlimited water etc, because you can't see the edge of the map during playing (even with alt+arrows not).

For water I always add about 8-10 tiles around the map (depends on the map too), or add "fake" buildings/roads at the edge too to fill it up. Some people like designing a map in one corner of a map and working outwards (so either one or two sides get rendered "infinitely" in-game) or, as I do, start around the middle and add water/fake buildings etc. As you can see from the screenshot of my map, I mapped it so there was "fake" stuff around the edges (the mountains in north, train track west, road and stuff east and hydro plant south) to make it less boring than having a mass of water.

Also I think any half-serious modder knows about the map edges will repeat to infinity Heck I even knew about it before I started modding I doubt I'll change my mapping style with water/fake edges though if I know I'm not working right at the edge of the map.

[elypter]

i think it looks better than if the map would end in nothing. it looks a bit strange on the minimap but during the game or on map screenshots this is a clear advantage in my opinion. for water around the outer blocks of the map just need to be water. But i also think that it should be possible to switch it on/off to be able to temporary store something outside the maparea.

[T.M.]

Some people like designing a map in one corner of a map and working outwards (so either one or two sides get rendered "infinitely" in-game) or, as I do, start around the middle and add water/fake buildings etc.

What if you didnt have to think about the edges at all, and resize your map as you expand it? But only be limited on 256x256 size, so you could resize your map on run time at any of the directions without need to re-script or move any of your map blocks manually.

Seriously, you wont see the repetitive edges in my editor, only in the GTA2

[Pyro]

What if you didnt have to think about the edges at all, and resize your map as you expand it?

Unfortunately to me, making water/fake map edges is almost like breathing - I do it without knowing it (not literal of course - but I do it anyway and never see it as time wasted or an issue). Too die-hard in my old ways

But only be limited on 256x256 size, so you could resize your map on run time at any of the directions without need to re-script or move any of your map blocks manually.
...
Seriously, you wont see the repetitive edges in my editor, only in the GTA2

Again, should be optional. I like adding a little detail, even to the map edges if I can and don't require this feature. At best, if you get rocket blasted in to the air you can't see more than about 6 blocks away anyway, hence why I like a comfortable 8-10 block outer edge (water/buildings), so there is no need to repeat it (in my case). Besides, even if it shows at run-time and not in editor the game still has to render ALL those wasted blocks to the map edges which the player will never see.

[T.M.]

Again, should be optional. I like adding a little detail, even to the map edges if I can and don't require this feature. At best, if you get rocket blasted in to the air you can't see more than about 6 blocks away anyway, hence why I like a comfortable 8-10 block outer edge (water/buildings), so there is no need to repeat it (in my case).

Why it needs to be optional if you cant even see it...? Thats basically what is my point here... its like complaining about the 256x256 edges repetition: "it should be optional!" but its not! Edge repetition only assures that you will never see the black space which makes your screen look funny. Now we can have this functionality to any size maps. If you cant deal with that, how could you deal with 256x256 map sizes? I really dont get it.

Besides, even if it shows at run-time and not in editor the game still has to render ALL those wasted blocks to the map edges which the player will never see.

No. It doesnt.

[Pyro]

It's not the same thing. True map edges are hard coded into the game/editor (the orange blocks do that - you'll see them at map edge). Yours is entirely optional and artificially created.

It seems overall you're adding different features but almost missing the main reason for making this program of yours in the first place - a true map editor. Surely it makes more sense to try and do that before adding extra things like this anyway? It's come a long way since just a map viewer and zone editor and I particularly like the script objects viewable in the map viewer. Might be worth taking a step back and looking at what you originally set out to do.

In true design fashion, the KISS principle for you:
KISS - Keep It Simple and Straightforward!

[Sektor]

We have the official map editor for now but we don't have an easy way to place cars and objects. That's what I'm looking forward to the most. I don't need fancy script editing, just placing cars quickly would be great.

[T.M.]

Yeah, i am focusing on script editor now. Adding some other small things once in while doesnt hurt the development Just stop me from getting bored

If i just code it straight forward, i dont have much time for thinking: more bugs and more code rewriting

[T.M.]

What those blue letters did again? only gives water cannon and jeep gun, and if i fire, GTA2 crashes... Any useful purpose for those letters?

[elypter]

if collected by tank jeep or firetruck collect use them it doesn't(always) crash. And the otrher collectable could be used for scripting afaik.

[Gustavob]

The yellow (from COLLECT_11 till COLLECT_14) and blue (from COLLECT_24 to COLLECT_27) letters do nothing when you pick them up and "fire" with them, they simply show up on screen and you pick them up when walking/driving over them. The turret weapons (JEEP_GUN, TANK_ROCKET_LAUNCHER, WATER_CANNON, CAR_FLAMETHROWER, WATER_CANNON) will crash when not used in their respective vehicles (except for CAR_FLAMETHROWER wich also works in the GUNJEEP/Armed Land Roamer)

[T.M.]

So they are useless because you cant ensure players pick them up with only the proper vehicles...?

[Sektor]

You could if you only gave them access to compatible vehicles. I doubt anyone will use them and if they do they can place them manually.

[T.M.]

I made the TOWER object placed always 1 block higher when you move it with mouse (you can still adjust the Z position if you like to) Is this okay?

Im thinking to adjust all of the blocking objects mouse placement like that too, tunnel blocker has 0.5 blocks under ground etc.

[elypter]

good plan. that makes it much more intuitive.

[T.M.]

I'm taking suggestions for the script format the editor will output, current format:

Code: Select all

OBJ_DATA varname = CREATE_OBJ (123.45, 123.45, 123.45) 22 TUNNEL_BLOCKER END

Yes, thats not valid code because of declaration&function call, but it shows all the styles (strings are converted uppercase, except variables) and max possible precision is 2 decimals.

Also, the editor will automatically choose the 2d coordinate or 3d coordinate for script objects (if you move them with mouse), so such code as:

Code: Select all

varname = CREATE_OBJ (123.45, 123.45, 2.0) 0 TUNNEL_BLOCKER END

Might be converted into:

Code: Select all

varname = CREATE_OBJ (123.45, 123.45) 0 TUNNEL_BLOCKER END

But if you change the z-position manually in the editor (pressing keys 1 and 2 with combination to shift or control), then it will save the object with 3d coordinates.

Also, the editor will not try to use 2d coordinates (from objects that were saved in 3d coordinates) in output script unless you have moved the object with mouse. I am thinking to re-do this to act in the following way: convert to 2d coordinates always when possible. Is this good idea?

[elypter]

Sometimes collectibles are placed in tunnels or in mid air. This should still be possible. If the editor can detect if the 3d coordinate is redundant i think its a good idea. There is only one situation i could think of where this is maybe not wanted: someone places a powerup on the ground but midgame the block below will be removed and the powerup shout stay in mid air. I don't know where gta will actually place it or if someone wants to make such a map but it would be no harm if it is possible to manually force a coordinate pair to be 3d.